what best attack_do or send_suicide 0

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Ahzz
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:03 am

Postby Ahzz » Sun May 20, 2007 9:45 am

it depends. in send suicide 0 they might just attack at a certain location, in attack add they gather units before attacking. send sucide sends all military to attack... attack add only sends those specified~
Heinermann
Posts: 362
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2007 12:42 am

Postby Heinermann » Sun May 20, 2007 3:32 pm

Actually, strategic suicide mission gathers units before attacking as well.
Ahzz
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:03 am

Postby Ahzz » Sun May 20, 2007 3:35 pm

true, but what I've seen its not same sort of gathering as in attack add. in strategic suicide, atleast if done by the script, mainly attack adds, yeah, maybe gathers a bit before its destination. Attack add gathers unit already a bit beforehand.
Scourge_Splitter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 12:56 pm

Postby Scourge_Splitter » Thu May 24, 2007 5:52 pm

[quote name='Ahzz' post='448' date='May 20 2007, 05:35 PM']true, but what I've seen its not same sort of gathering as in attack add. in strategic suicide, atleast if done by the script, mainly attack adds, yeah, maybe gathers a bit before its destination. Attack add gathers unit already a bit beforehand.[/quote]

this is the difference yes, but which is now the better one.. I'd say, it depends what kind of attack you wish.
the disadvantage from attack_do & attack_add is that you first actually NEED the specified amount,
when using send_suicide 0 is just rounds up almost everything it has.
I did notice it used also science vessels, arbiters and queens during these.

In my current scripts I prefer a send_suicide every now and then.
saves also space in coding
Ahzz
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:03 am

Postby Ahzz » Thu May 24, 2007 6:27 pm

well send suicide 0 has its gains. for example... it makes the coding easier, as the AI prepares for the next attack and crap... it could be used to train or go further in tech in some cases. Then again, the attack goes more along the lines of "pick all units and attack add to location". Any decent player keeps its units a bit separate, so they can kill the army part at a time, and if the AI's army is spread up, part of the army will go completely different route which separates them up even more. It depends of the situation... suicide 0 is good for clearing the AI tho.
Scourge_Splitter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 12:56 pm

Postby Scourge_Splitter » Tue May 29, 2007 6:55 am

I've mainly been using send_suicide now because it sends every unit on the attack.
and for the gameplay in my mod, it has some very interesting en cool results :P

and yes, it is a very good way to clear up some supply space, espaecially since terrans train and train and train and their base becoming clocked with units, so a send_suicide instead of a attack_add/attack_prepare really purges the supply value :D
Ahzz
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:03 am

Postby Ahzz » Tue May 29, 2007 7:20 am

but. wanna know whats bad about a suicide timer? Well. This I've especially seen in raynor 2.0... It attacks and attacks, and loses its army and rebuilds units again... and wont ever get further in tech tree. My AI fusion MACRO script beat it in longer games because it didn't get higher tech, and because its units had 3-3-3 when the zerg had 0-0-1
Scourge_Splitter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 12:56 pm

Postby Scourge_Splitter » Tue May 29, 2007 5:22 pm

That's the importance you MUST never lose track of.
Send_suicide 0 is a preferably attack option but when you let it train a good group of units (diversity) and let them atatck due to a send suicide command and then just resume teching for a while it will tech further and not lose time on keeping the units up.

I've experienced before that a looping suicide run can do better as an attack_add command since you dont actually HAVE to train units before.
with this I mean, you can call the suicide run in a multirunner block and loop it, or create a somewhat more controlled sequence of suicide missions.

as long as kept apart from the troop training and teching block it very well possible.

I have some more to the lines of these:

[spoiler]...
train 6 marine
train 2 firebat
multirun blockSEND-SUICIDE-ATTACK
build 1 factory 100
wait_buildstart 1 factory
train 8 marine
...

...
multirun blockSUICIDE-LOOP
build 1 physics_lab 90
wait_buildstart 1 physics_lab
train 1 battlecruiser
multirun blockSEND-BATTLECRUISER-SUICIDE
train 2 battlecruiser
train 5 wraith

:blockSEND-SUICIDE-ATTACK
wait_train x marine
wait_train x firebat

:blockSUICIDE-LOOP
wait 500
send_suicide 0
wait 4500
goto blockSUICIDE-LOOP

:blockSEND-BATTLECRUISER-SUICIDE
wait 4500
send_suicide 0
wait 500
goto blockSUICIDE-LOOP[/spoiler]

remember, the above piece is just an example.

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